Neem to eleminate Candida?

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June 12, 2005 7:09 AM

Has anyone ever used Neem in any of the phases to eleminate Candida?
 
 
 
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June 13, 2005 1:51 PM

Welcome to Whole Approach Cary,

We do not use neem in our protocol. However the products that we do use have a long history of excellent results. You'll find a testimonial page called success stories from our members in the Attogram/Lahoz FAQ section. And so that you know a little bit more about how we help people here, I'll include our welcome post for you below. It will lead you to lots of links that will help you get an overview of the benefits of using the Whole Approach products and joining the Whole Approach forum.

In addition to inclusion in an amazing community of candida forum buddies (a “taste” of which you have already experienced), the Whole Approach program involves a recovery diet integrated with anti-fungal colon cleansing and systemic yeast treatment. If you follow the links in the welcome link I’m going to include below, you’ll get a feel for the extent of the program benefits that we offer here. The products are available through the online store. Our forum is intended to help counsel folks who have chosen the Whole Approach product line for their anti-fungal program. Proceeds from the sale of these products pay for the maintenance of this forum.

Whole Approach has been supporting customers using the Attogram purge drink and complementary products since 1991. We’ve searched, (and continue to search), the natural products industry for the very best products to help us help you and we have coached thousands of members as they work through the challenges of the whole body, whole self, detoxifying, candida cleanse that is essential for a full recovery from Candida Related Complex (CRC). As you read about the Whole Approach products and diet, if you decide that this approach feels right for you and you choose to embark upon the Whole Approach healing path, I will be pleased to be your guide. I come on the forums Monday, Wednesday and Friday evenings for ninety minutes or so to answer questions about the program.

Please check out the welcome post that I’m going to post for you and go to the Getting Started section from the link on it. From there you’ll find a whole list of Getting Started related links that will essentially guide you through the exploration of the important parts of our site. It’s a pretty low-tech tour but it does the job and will help you learn about the many ways that the Whole Approach forum, site and products can help you.

Because most folks who come to us are coping with some similar issues we have provided a lot of information in the FAQ sections, the article sections, the Diet sections and the other areas of the site that would otherwise require repetition frequently. Please do take the time to get to know the layout of our forums and our information sections. There is a great deal of helpful information available here. We also have an excellent search engine with advanced search options that make it possible to be quite specific in your search. If you have trouble finding something in the layout of the forums and you can’t find it in the search engines, by all means, just ask me and I’ll be happy to help.

We have some incredible and supportive forum members here. Mutual support and sharing are what makes this forum such a special and helpful place to visit and our members cultivate the family feeling and usefulness of this forum more creatively and lovingly than we could ever have hoped for when this forum began. As a result, in addition to the help that I can offer you, you may also enjoy help from your fellow members as you find your way (a little bit of which you've already experienced.) Once you become a Whole Approach veteran, we hope that you too will take pleasure in offering support and guidance to others as they begin their healing journey. Thank you for joining our healing community. We’re pleased to have you aboard.

Tari-Lee (or…“TLC”- my initials)

P.S. Here's the "welcome link" I promised:

Welcome to the Whole Approach forum
 
 
 
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June 13, 2005 2:42 PM

Thanks for the info Tarilee, This website is really a blessing!!

Here is some background on myself:

In 2000, I had severe problems with diarrhea (15 to 20 times a day), 3 months and 3 doctors later, it was determined that I had Clostridium Difficle. I was given Vancomycin for 10 days. This seemed to help. Within a week, the symptoms were back. I went back to the Dr. he said he couldn't see me for 3 months and go to the emergency room. They confirmed the C'Diff was still there. I was back on Vanco again for 14 days. I struggled for months/years afterwards as my intestinal track tried to regain some balance. I could tell it was always borderline balance because of the symptoms. During the bout with C'Diff related diarrhea, I had muscle spasms so bad that I felt my stomach stretch. I had pain every night at my sternum. I went to several Dr's, most wanted to prescribe Zoloft, Buspiron and other antianxiety and depression drugs.

Finally, I went to a surgeon on my own and had a scope of my stomach done. It was determined that I has a severe hiatal hernia. I had surgery to repair the hernia as well a stomach wrap to prevent GIRD. Which turns out the wrap procedure wasn't needed. During the surgery, I was given antibiotics to prevent infection. Three weeks after the surgery I began losing weight, brain fog, sore/weak eyes, anxiety/depression, joint pain, white tongue, etc. I went back to the surgeon, he said it was anxiety and depression, he prescribed Lexapro. Great, another clueless Dr.

In January of this year, I went to a Dr. In Albuquerque that was familiar with Candida. He ran blood and stool tests and determined I had Candida. He prescribed Fluconozole for 3 months and the same strict diet (no Sugar, no Carbs). I could tell this was helping, after 3 months, I was gaining weight and feeling better (not well, but better). One month later, (Mid May) all my symptoms and weight loss started again. Now I feel I'm right back where I started.

I found your website and purchased the purge products late week. I was not able to get the Caproyl and used Caprylic Acid caplets mixed with olive oil (this seemed to work OK). I have ordered the Caproyl, it should arrive early next week.

I just had a blood screen this morning, it showed very little candida (Looked long and hard for one small spec). My question is: After the above history, does the intestinal track need time to repair itself? I think I should continue the Purge Program but without Caproyl?? What are your thoughts?
 
 
 
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June 15, 2005 11:26 AM

Hi Cary,

There is a post in the Attogram Lahoz Protocol FAQ section that discusses the challenges associated with diagnosing candida. Folks with severe candidiasis along with the need for intestinal healing will sometimes require as much as several months and even years of therapeutic eating, immune support and anti-fungal cleansing of the colon and other body systems. From what I gather, you've been through a lot and you have been exposed to many of the factors that predispose one to severe candida overgrowth (antibiotics, surgery, strong drug treatments,and intestinal illness.)Therefore, I think your instinct to pursue a candida detoxification program seems wise. Candida overgrowth is inevitable in the situation you describe and it is possible that it plays a significant role in your symptom picture.Here is a link to the Protocol FAQ section. It includes many answers to questions about the protocol that Whole Approach recommends.Protocol FAQ's

Although I feel it is very important to have a supportive MD with you along your healing path, I feel that the diagnositics and medicines that most MD's rely on in the identification and treatment of candida issues, are insufficient. You'll be able to read more about my thoughts on the challenges of accurately diagnosing candida overgrowth using blood tests and stool tests if you look up the "Diagnosing Candida" post I mentioned above.

The drug treatments that MD's can offer have limited effectiveness and come each with some risks and side effects. Because they do not facilitate the removal of wastes, only the killing of candida, a very toxic body condition caused by a build up of candida by products can arise from their use (Die Off). Also, they are simple anti-fungal agents and candida can quickly adapt themselves to a form that is resistant to the drug. This, and the possibility that you were experiencing Die Off could explain your temporary improvement on the drug antifungal. Candida Die-Off: Your Healing Friend and Foe

Below is a link to an interesting post that compares the theory of herbal medicine to that of pharmaceutical medicine.
Plants vs. Pharmaceuticals
This link will take you to a clinical comparison of the products used by our members and common anti-fungal drug treatments. Not all the ones that you’ve used are on this list but it may still be interesting to you:
Comparison of Attogram products to drug therapy

You mention that you may want to do the purge drink without the Caproyl. Some folks start the program for up to a few weeks using just the Psyllium, Bentonite and DDS Acidophilus or Probioplus before they start the anti-fungal. This is to give them a chance to adjust to positive diet changes before starting to kill off candida. Perhaps this is why you were considering it. If you were thinking that you would rather avoid anti-fungal treatment for now, this is understandable given all that you’ve been through. You can make all kinds of positive changes in your food and product protocol until your body has been supported and cleansed enough that you feel ready to take on the yeast detoxification. If you are looking for extra support for your intestinal tract to facilitate healing, you may want to take a look at the Complementary Supplements post in the protocol section
Complementary Supplements. You’ll find all kinds of supportive products to help strengthen your current condition.

I may not have answered your concerns and if I’ve misunderstood you or missed something in your post, please just ask me again. Good luck as you embark on your new healing journey and congratulations for taking these important first steps towards CRC-free, vibrant health. Take good care,

TLC
 
 
 
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June 15, 2005 1:19 PM

Tarilee, Thanks for detailed response. You answered my specific questions.

I do have a couple more questions. 1) I see in the Treatment Overview page that the purge drink consists of Bentonite, Psyllium and Caproyl are mixed together. It doesn't mention the Acidophilus being added to the mix. In the "One Women's Experience" it does mention the use of Acidophilus in the mix? Are there reasons for one or the other? 2) In the Forum, it says the Acidophilus should not be taken with meals. Should the Acidophilus be taken with the drink and again separately between meals? Thanks again for the support.
 
 
 
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June 15, 2005 2:09 PM

Oh, by the way, I was in Calgary last week on business. It's a beatiful city, when it's not raining Frown It rained all week.
 
 
 
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June 15, 2005 9:12 PM

Hi Cary wave1,

Tarilee will be able to explain the reasons for all this but I thought I'd pipe in until she returns. Collette Lahoz recommends using the acidophilus with the Purge. Linda and Tarilee here at Whole Approach have decided that the acidophilus might be more effective when it is taken on an empty stomach and not with the Purge.

Here is what Tarilee says about this in the Attogram/Lahoz Facts Section:

"I’ve heard that I should mix the DDS in with the purge drink but I’ve also heard of folks taking it between meals. When and how should I take it?

You may mix the acidophilus with the drink and or, take it on its own. For years, Attogram customers have been mixing it with the drink and been getting good results so if you prefer, you may continue following the original instructions.

However, we in fact altered our recommendation in this regard a few years ago (in 2002). Over the years, we have had some folks taking the DDS several times per day in addition to mixing it in with the drink and have had very positive feedback from this approach. My approach has always been to have my clients take it separately on an empty stomach as I feel that the bacteria have an easier time of implanting themselves in the intestinal wall when they are consumed without the fibre. In cases of extreme intestinal distress, antibiotic treatment or constipation, some folks benefit from taking large doses of UAS’s Probioplus (up to 8 per day.) This formula is our preferred acidophilus supplement and its effects can be felt within a couple of days of use, especially when used in large doses.

As with almost every aspect of the nutritional field, the issue of when to take probiotics is a hot topic of debate. The main argument is whether it should be taken with food or without food. You will hear of professionals in the field who have opinions which differ from ours. Our Whole Approach team has weighed the odds, observed the results of each approach and changed our recommendations to favour taking the DDS on an empty stomach. You may still, of course, follow whichever approach feels best for you."

Hope this helps!

Sharon hearthrob
 
 
 
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June 16, 2005 6:51 AM

Sharon, Thanks for the advice. I tend to agree that taking the probotics on a empty stomach would have a better chance of being absorbed in the system.

On a side note, Have you ever heard of mixing an opened probiotic capsule with Extra Virgin Olive Oil? Can the probiotic survive when mixed in the EVOO?

Thanks, Cary
 
 
 
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June 16, 2005 3:40 PM

Hi Cary,

I would assume that the probiotic would survive in an olive oil since that's part of the contents of the Caproyl, I think. But, I still wonder if the bacteria would set to work on the olive oil and would thereby be distracted from doing it's good work on your body.

I'm not sure though. Tarilee would be the one to answer this.

Sharon hearthrob
 
Last edited by SamplerSharon June 17, 2005 9:21 AM
 
 
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June 17, 2005 12:02 PM

Hi Cary,

Sharon has answered your question and I'll just add one point (Thanks Sharon! You're awesome!)

Actually, the oil is one of the strongest antagonists to the probiotics in the purge mix so I would not recommend mixing it in with olive oil. If you're doing so for topical use then this would be the exception in which I would recommend it because it is one of the better bases for topical treatments but it is challenging for bacteria to grow in the presence of oil.

Take care.

TLC
 
 
 
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